Guest excedrin Posted February 18, 2002 Report Posted February 18, 2002 (This message was left blank) Edited by: excedrin at: 3/20/02 6:18:24 pm
Rahsash Geldich Posted February 18, 2002 Report Posted February 18, 2002 ::applauds loudly:: The drama you unfold portrays itself in an incredibly eloquent manner! Very, very, very good!
Peredhil Posted February 18, 2002 Report Posted February 18, 2002 Interesting imagery. Complex read. But then, I can't write either. I'll be quiet now...
Bhurin Posted February 19, 2002 Report Posted February 19, 2002 I'm afraid adjectives fail me... Very enriched word play; you seamlessly sew together multiple metaphors and observations into an almost erratic pattern. It's very beautiful... It sounds like you're providing personal insight into many aspects, most prominently aspects of religious faith. You mention the symbols of crosses and what I can only guess are strengths and weaknesses of said faith. (Going back for a second, I must say that your seond verse is very insightful. I won't pretend to comprehend it, but it seems as though you pack satire relating to human "advancement", the loss of faith and religion, and a swift rush of movement described as "tragic". That immediately swept my thoughts from the moment into the work). And the structure! Dear sweet bagles, this was extraordinary! (I greatly apologize, but I'm a structure-maniac, and quite often allow a certain amount of superficial interest into the form of the poem). Repeated verses; shifting style and rhyme scheme (I liked how you excentuated "We're dying" by giving it it's own line); and varying rhythm and diction. This poem almost hurt to read! I couldn't possibly sit here and attempt to disect this work. I'm afraid it will take some time and a few more reads before I can even fake a grasp on it. The only thing I'm left wondering about is the title of the thread... However, this work is superb, at the very least by my own personal standards. Thank you. Signed- >Edited by: Bhurin at: 2/18/02 9:07:35 pm
Guest Rezure Posted February 19, 2002 Report Posted February 19, 2002 Well, Well, Well... that's got to be the best thing I've ever read that I've ever gotten to through AM... Except for this part: "In the stream of consciousness There is a river crying Living comes much easier Once we admit We're dying" I don't care much for that. Maybe there's some intricate point that it holds together that I'm completely missing (wouldn't be the first time) but to me except for that stanza, just frame it up, it's that good. I'm really hoping he wrote this and the title is just a misnomeror some sort of hint at the meaning and not what I thought it meant at first after I read the poem... Oh, and to answer the question, no I can't. P.S.: There, I've finally caved in and commented positively on something someone did. But at least it's for something really really good...
Gwaihir Posted February 19, 2002 Report Posted February 19, 2002 You already know how much I like the poem, but I feel a need to praise your beautiful "inability" to write ---------- I want to be page 93 of Pineapples, the Avian Crows-Nyyark
Guest excedrin Posted February 20, 2002 Report Posted February 20, 2002 ok, just to clarify, the actual TITLE of the poem is lines in the sand, i just felt like being a brat and making the title of the post i cant write
Lady Celes Crusader Posted February 20, 2002 Report Posted February 20, 2002 NIce poem. I think that Zool decorticated it pretty much like you wanted him to do, Kin. As for me, since poetry is not my forte, I can only tell that I like it.
The Portrait of Zool Posted February 21, 2002 Report Posted February 21, 2002 I hope Excedrin likes feedback - cause I have some. I really like this poem, but what is it about? That question is very central to critiqueing this poem, because at first reading it can appear unfocused, vague, disjointed. It covers so much ground, and entails so many complex metaphors and references that it may be very difficult to tie it all together. I think this is easily explainable because it is ultimately about change, but more on that later. I feel the author did a fantastic job, but more important than the technical skill at manipulating emotions or structure or painting visions in our skulls, which the author shows in abundance, I prize this poem so highly for the the depth with which it was written - for having been written from the heart. That is what makes this poem so powerful. Even though it is full of pain, fear, and disapointment, the feelings are REAL, and vividly portrayed. Though it is a very complex poem, the reader feels and identifies with the emotion, some more than others, but the author covers that too, which is yet another revealling layer of complexity. I think all people at one time or another will feel this pain (except Ronald Reagen), but I really have to hand it to this author for haveing navigated through this complex labyrinth of emotions and counter emotions without losing his way so that, correctly read, it can serve as a roadmap for the rest of us, and THAT is what writing from the heart is all about, because all hearts are alike inside, it's just getting inside that's tough. Anyway... The title has everything to do with this poem in my mind, and I will reference the appropriate points when I come to them. Excedrin sets the stage with this line; "Sometimes, for a moment of bliss And the passion, we're craving" This is the works first opening of flaw (thus, the drama we are drawn into). "Sometimes, for a moment of bliss And the passion, we're craving" To me, this carries every evidence of an addiction. Now, addiction is a strong word, but I feel it is entirely appropriate here, and that the rest of the psyche of the poem hinges on this addiction. To go on; "There's a message we miss Sometimes when, the spirits left alone We must believe in something To find if we've grown" The opening stanza is the key to understanding the entire poem. We have the craving of passion, then, there's a message we miss. "Sometimes when, the spirits left alone We must believe in something To find if we've grown". We have words like "miss" and "Left alone", followed by the suggestion that without outside direction we will be unaware of our growth. The passage wreaks of a dull anxiety, of angst added to valuelessness - sort of the angst of the new millenium. How else can we properly judge the state of our growth but by the values we keep? A very powerful message. The second stanza thrusts us into a psychic scene, counterpointing the opening stanza. In the first stanza we had a sense of time, of proportion and of identity. Not here; Tragic reflex, shattered calm Static progress, senses gone Numb awareness, final psalm From this I get a sense of extremes, going from the physical sensations to the biblical, placing me in a spiritual verses physical dilemna. The author's structural evocation of the distance between the divine and the gross (physical) is very apt for this subject. Every line, every word further supports or builds the emotional nuance within the experience, the stated opposites stabbing with their uncompromising finality into the mind, opening it to encompass the entirety of the dilemna. The next stanza is the strongest metaphorically, and honestly bears repeating 3 times. "Swept away with the tide" Here we have the image of the inevitableness of the tide over time, another admission of the pressures in the poems drama. "Through the holes in my hands Crown of thorns at my side" Holes in his hands, by what? To me this obviously refers to the crucifixition, of the Christ's sacrifice, and so we must all sacrifice our youth, and shoulder the responsibilities that will save our selves - and what of the rebirth that comes from the sacrificial death? The author does not say. That the mark of his sacrifice is described as the instrument of his failure is to be explained in more detail later. The crown at his side signifies that he is not his savior - yet. "Drawing lines in the sand" The last line of the refrain amplifies the futility and frustration felt at having given away the passion of his youth - for what? Our subject does not know, or rather as we shall see he does know, but is it worth it? Here I first see a glimmer of reference to the title, which is amplified each time this stanza is repeated. "Sometimes, if you're perfectly still You can hear the virgin weeping For the savior of your will Sometimes, your castles in the air And the fantasies you're seeking Are the crosses you bear" Here he states perfectly the conundrum of a soul caught between the visions of his dreams, the "fantasies" and "castles in the air", and the disillusionment of his reality, and how much his dreams and his demands to see them realized hurt him - But who can just toss away their dreams? "You can hear the virgin weeping For the savior of your will," transposes his "will" in the role of savior. He feels he has paid the price, but the expected trade-off isn't there, he isn't saved, and he has no one to blame but himself, thus making his dreams "the crosses you bear". The virgin weeping for the savior shows the responsibility the subject feels for his self-defeat. The prelude to the second refrain matches the structure of the other refrain prelude, this time on an even more personal level. Here he states a perfect distillation of every major theme, and conjures a sense of helpless witnessing in the end; "Sacred conflict, blessed prize Weeping crosses, stainless eyes Desperate addict, faith disguised" "Sacred conflict, blessed prize," we covered as the dilemna of the life's demands versus the subject's higher aspirations, echoing the title again. "Weeping crosses, stainless eyes," paints a scene of tragedy, and unfeeling, uncaring witnesses, perhaps on both the spiritual and physical levels. It evokes the feeling of being misunderstood, or worse, ignored. "Desperate addict," echoes the opening revelation of the conflict. "Faith disguised" I surmise refers to a public face, but here the reference is perhaps too personal. It could refer to the emptiness felt when one is hopeless, even when enjoying consolation or refuge, or a combination of the meanings. I'm not sure on this one. The next stanza is fully about his consciousness of the situation, the mechanism of how we are our own worst enemy by placing a crushing responsibility over our heads, and how it changes a person. "We fabricate our demons Invite them into our homes Have supper with the aliens And fight the war alone We conjure up our skeletons Enlist the den of thieves Frightened from our closets Then sewn upon our sleeves" It is possible to think too deeply down the wrong channel. Here, as he often does in the poem, the author portrays a scene of helplessly watching as he destroys himself. The fears and desires are personal, but the locked battle is layed bare. "In the stream of consciousness There is a river crying Living comes much easier Once we admit We're dying" The first two lines refer to a deep sadness, a beautiful metaphor tying together the self (stream of consciousness), force (the river) and sadness (crying), with the last two combined beautifully and segueing to the depiction of his submission to the pain toward his eventual transmutation. The mood or "moment" of this poem describes a quiet frustration, a desperate acceptance, of riding that cusp between expectation and cold reality - you might call it an "early life crises". In the line, "Living comes much easier once we admit We're dying", the author describes a sense of loss of self in the submission to the demands of life, of living. That is how one feels when one loses his self, as if he were dying, like a golem pulled through his days by strings which are not his. No joy, no passion, no hope. In this case, the death is very real, the death of his romantic youthful notions about reality. As he points out in the previous stanza, our demons are self made. "Sometimes, in the wreckage of our wake There's a bitterness we harbor And hate for hatred's sake Sometimes we dig an early grave And crucify our instincts For the hope we couldn't save" Resentment and bitterness at the choice he feels he has to make. This is the fulcrum of the pain, the bitterness of having to give up what the subject feels is rightfully his, and resentment for not getting what he feels is rightfully his. Sometimes a view from sinless eyes Centers our perspective And pacifies our cries Sometimes the anguish we survive And the mysteries we nurture Are the fabrics of our lives Here the poem admits to the healling power of momentarily pulling out of the crushing perspective of self judgement and the desire for immediate rewards. It goes on to capture the essence of the forces that are so compelling, revealling the loss of spiritual perspective as the destructive pressures surge, and all those dreams are "Swept away with the tide". Swept away with the tide Through the holes in my hands Crown of thorns at my side Drawing lines in the sand What is the final resolution of the subject in "I Can't Write, Can You?"? The author does not say, but I would hope that he would say "Yes" to life instead of fighting it so. One must have his dreams, but mysteriously, accomplishment is rooted in mundanity, and fortunately too, for this is what makes accomplishment possible. ~Zool~ Ancient, The Pen is Mightier than the Sword. Bard of Terra, Patron Saint of Aspiring Bards. Elder than dirt, more foolish than a jester, able to trip over the smallest logic in a single step. It's... Oh, you know. Edited by: Zool47 at: 2/20/02 3:09:21 pm
Guest Zephryin Posted March 20, 2002 Report Posted March 20, 2002 Uhh...Hey... What happened to the poem?? As Cheech might say, "Like, iss not der anymore, man!" Edited by: Zephryin at: 3/20/02 6:25:44 pm
Falcon2001 Posted March 21, 2002 Report Posted March 21, 2002 That's it, why can't people just tell the other pen members to screw off instead of deleting all their poetry...and WHAT THE HECK DOES NT MEAN? Jeez, if you've got a complaint, say something. Cioden Darkeye Quill-Bearer - The Pen is Mightier than the Sword President of the Peredhil Fan Club Owner of the Reply Raven - Enemy to all those who never post responses Ashaman - WoT - Blitz II Council - The Hunters - Blitz II Leisure Officer - SFV Ultima - Beta
reverie Posted March 21, 2002 Report Posted March 21, 2002 Wait a minute? So it wasn't about a beach ball? @$@$% i never get anything right. revery the dreamlost "rastafar..." the dream continues...
The Portrait of Zool Posted March 21, 2002 Report Posted March 21, 2002 "NT" means "No Text", shorthand for intentionally leaving something blank. Yah, it is a very sad display. ~Zool~ Ancient, The Pen is Mightier than the Sword. Bard of Terra, Patron Saint of Aspiring Bards. Elder than dirt, more foolish than a jester, able to trip over the smallest logic in a single step. It's... Oh, you know.
Peredhil Posted March 4, 2003 Report Posted March 4, 2003 The author deleted the original post, which was "Lines in the Sand" by the Dream Theater. Zool's excellent feedback mades more sense if you read the original work, which may be found Here
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