Feedback Rating

[Katzaniel]

Okay, this is sort of ironic but mostly just an interesting prospect: I am asking for feedback on this feedback thingamajig.

 

The goal is that, by giving yourself a numeric designation (or, if it has to get more complicated, a number and letter or something like that) that tells people at a glance what your goal is for feedback. You would be able to give yourself a default number, and also to give certain pieces a separate rating. (PS It's geared toward stories... should there be a separate one for each area or not? People can feel very different about their poetry vs stories vs RP, but then again perhaps the rating guide should be the same?)

 

Please tell me whether you think you could easily fit yourself into one of these, or how you'd change it if not, or whether you'd even use the thing. Any and all comments appreciated.

 

Version 1.0:

 

Although each of your stories may be different, it is very helpful to us when someone can post a general outline of what they want in the way of feedback. Are you new here and just want to share your work? Do you have little or no intention to revisit old stories? If this is the case, then you don't want to find your self-esteem shattered by drive-by advice from someone who assumes you want to want to improve, and only means well. On the other hand, if you're a seasoned veteran of creative writing classes and are looking only to get better, then you don't want to be left a bunch of "Great job"s or, even worse, nothing at all for your efforts.

 

Please, read through the following descriptions, and decide which one suits you as a default. If any given story differs from that, you can always indicate as much in a comment preceding or following the piece. ("This one is about my grandmother and dear to me... please, it's a 0." or "I'm entering this to a writing contest... I'd appreciate as much as 4.")

 

0. Just sharing.

 

I currently have no intention of revisiting this story. I don't really want to hear anything, good or bad.

 

1. What have I done right?

 

I don't have much intention of coming back to my story, but I'd like to know whether people are reading, and what sort of feelings the story is evoking. I would also like to hear general comments about which parts are working well so that I know not to change how I'm doing those things.

 

2. Just tweaks.

 

I don't have much intention to do any rehauling of this, but if you've found a grammatical mistake or minor inconsistency, I wouldn't mind your sharing. I'd also like to know whether or not people are reading.

 

3. How can this be better?

 

I have an eye to improvement, though this story in particular may not be revisited. If you have general information about what I've done right and how I can improve, feel free to share it.

 

4. Whatever you've got!

 

I'm not sure whether I'll come back to this or not, but either way I can take a verbal beating on it. If you have any comments at all, from spelling errors to plot overhauls, then go ahead and share it. Please: Don't hold back any comments - let me decide whether or not to ignore it.

 

5. Details for improvement.

 

I have an eye to improvement, and though it may not be immediate I intend to come back to this story. Please share any details that you can about what's good and what needs to be fixed. Again: Let me decide whether it's worth my while.

 

6. The bad, the bad and the ugly.

 

I want this story, over time and revisions, to become the best it can be. Don't even bother with a comment unless you make it worthwhile with specific information about why you liked the parts you did, and what should be improved about the parts you didn't.

 

For example, my own feedback guideline would state that I intend to come back to the majority of stories that I write, though I only really end up revisiting a few. I don't want anyone to hold anything back while reviewing, so a 3 is too low, but I don't want to request a 5 unless I'm more serious about a given piece, so I'd go with 4. I even have a story or two for which I might request 6... but by default, I'm a 4.

 

Keep in mind that 4 is higher than you should freely request - it gives people the freedom to review and offer any advice that comes to mind, but it also assumes that you are able to realize that most of it is opinion, and it's entirely up to you to decide whether their opinion has any more validity than your own.

Edited August 19, 2006 by Katzaniel

[Katzaniel]

Oh geez, I forgot to incorporate my own changes. Thanks to Appy's and Tanny's recent comments in that other Feedback thread, I have updated #1. (Or will in 3 seconds).

[Appy]

Just had a quick read, but this looks really good and easy to use

 

I would definitely be a 1 or a 2

[reverie]

I'd probably be a consistent 5 with the exception of my improvised works which are just brain storming exercises. Also, a 5 because I have tendency to revisit (sometimes spanning years) almost everything I write no matter how irrelevant it is. I doubt I'd ever be a 6 though, since I welcome all levels of feedback.

 

cool list. works for me.

 

oh just out of curiosity Katz, who are you quoting? Yourself?

 

rev...

Edited August 20, 2006 by reverie

[Tanuchan]

Yeah, looks good... 1 or 2 for me, mainly. Even a... 2.5 .

Edited August 20, 2006 by Tanuchan

[Quincunx]

I like it. Need to remember to use it. As a test, I read this, and canceled a 3/4ish comment on Tanuchan's recent, although not most recent, poems. Effort not expended, author not offended--commentary sitting heavy, unsaid--the lesser of two evils.

 

Should the Critics' Corner subtitle include "do place level 4+ feedback in here, not on the same thread as the original work" or similar disclaimer? Someone mentioned something-of-the-sort in the feedback thread. . .ah here it is--

 

"This is what I thought the Critic's Corner and the Writing Workshop were for; to post specifically for technical feedback and development."--Tanuchan, Feedback page two, Cabaret Room.

 

--which idea I've ignored in the past. That might solve the problem in the beginning in the post, where I can post analytical feedback far away from the original poem, and Tanny is under no obligation to read it.

 

[EDIT: I'm singling Tanuchan out only because I was writing that feedback at this time. I have held back on other feedback in the past, with the same weight on my mind.]

Edited August 21, 2006 by Quincunx

[reverie]

I like Q's compilation of ideas concerning the critic corner: The whole +4 feedback only in C.C. forum separate from the originating thread. However, we could also take a page from Cyril and post a post in the originating thread pointing out the more elaborate feedback in Critics Corner, or maybe not?

 

The author would still have no obligation to read the link to the Critics Corner, put it makes a nice pointer for anyone else interested in the higher level feedback. And of course the Author could object to this. Not sure of the best way to handle that, then.

 

Enforcement, particularly for new members could be an issue too.

 

Likewise, I often hold back in my feedback, but in the past if an author's profile F.B. lvl didn't say stop, I tend to go all out when something catches my eye. Hmm, actually after I get burned by an author for posting constructive feedback, I make a mental note of never to waste my time on them again, well other than a cursory "way-to-go" or "good job".

 

rev...

Edited August 21, 2006 by reverie

[Sweetcherrie]

Maybe it's an idea to post each work with a rating of the sort of feedback you want for that work. It would prevent misunderstandings (and that way you don't have to work with different forums)

 

Would it be possible to also have a ‘Give’ rating?

 

For example:

 

0: I don’t give feedback.

1: what I liked

2: what I didn’t like

3: possible improvements

4: technical aspects of the work

5: grammatical aspects

Etc….

 

I think it goes without saying that if you give feedback, you always give reasons as to why you thought this or that. To tell someone something is wrong without telling them WHY it is wrong, is simply wrong on its own already…

 

And of course if a person is asking for a level 1, you will not give a 4 even though you can.

 

In the end you could then put in your profile both sides of feedback.

 

For example mine would most likely be:

 

Give:

Poetry: 1+2, sometimes 3 or 5

Stories: 1+2+3+4, sometimes 5

Roleplay: 1+2+3+4, sometimes 5

 

Receive:

As defined in post.

 

Maybe there are other ways, most likely even This is just something I came up with in 5 minutes.

Edited August 21, 2006 by Sweetcherrie

[Gyrfalcon]

I think a give rating is also a very good idea, along with the rest of this concept. For example, if someone wants to poke me for feedback on the technical aspects of poetry, and my feedback field lacks the number or letter for technical feedback, they can glance at that and see that I'm not comfortable providing technical feedback on poetry, but I'd be happy to give my impressions and thoughts about it.

[Alaeha]

The problem I can see with a Give Rating is that it stands a pretty fair chance of coming to resemble "Geek Code". I'm relatively comfortable with all the aforementioned aspects, so if we just go with an "Ok/Not Ok" Switch I might put "1-5 Inclusive, but my threes may be out to lunch". If we start describing how "in depth" our feedback in various areas is on a typical day, or how comfortable we are, it could get a bit odd. For example, I'm perfectly comfortable discussing the positives, slightly less comfortable with the negatives (mostly for fear that the author would lash out and/or assume the fetal position), hit or miss with possible improvements, out of practice but still competent at the technical side of things, and a Grammar Fuhrer. So, if we ranked comfort on a 1-5 (5 High) Scale, I might be a 43235 (or, If we instead based it on a Letter Grading System, BCDCA).

 

Or, in short, if we're going to do it, we'll probably need to either keep it simple or make it verbose.

Edited August 22, 2006 by Alaeha

[Appy]

I would say keep it simple with the reminder that we're all human and mostly work with the subjective stuff... therefor anything not dealing with grammar and spelling cannot be right or wrong, it's a matter of opinion anyways.

But this 'grading' of ourselves would show levels of comfertness in dealing with certain aspects of critisicm, and that's what this was meant for right?

[reverie]

Personally, I think individual descriptions should determine the "give" factor not a specific set of ratings. Why? Because it's hard to hold yourself to a set standard of feedback when the art that you're reviewing is so diverse.

 

That's not to say a numeric guildline of some sort can't be devised, but I'm not sure if I'd ever be comfortable using it. Sometimes poems are just over my head when it comes to analysing their technical aspects, yet even a simple one line metaphor can throw me too. What I can give to one writer is not necessarily what I can offer to another.

 

Hmm, I think I need to revise my own profile after writing this.

 

rev...

Edited August 23, 2006 by reverie

[Katzaniel]

Should the Critics' Corner subtitle include "do place level 4+ feedback in here, not on the same thread as the original work" or similar disclaimer?

I love this idea. I never know where it's appropriate to post, and usually just do so in the actual thread. But this would be a nice guideline.

 

Enforcement, particularly for new members could be an issue too.

It certainly could. Not sure how to handle that, except that it seems after all this talk, we're all thinking about it, and if most of the old members were using it then the new ones would see it and try it, too. (Plus I'm thinking that maybe this would be the new requirement for entering the SWG, but not, and I repeat NOT making you a member just by using it, unless you want that).

 

Maybe it's an idea to post each work with a rating of the sort of feedback you want for that work.

Yes, I meant for this to be able to stand as either a default for all works and/or a specific rating for one work.

 

Would it be possible to also have a ‘Give’ rating?

Possible, but I'm with Alaeha in that I think it would soon become too difficult to really use. I like the idea... but I think it's not feasibe. Besides, don't you indicate what sort of feedback you give simply by giving it?

 

Though this does make me wonder whether a different sort of implementation of "give" feedback could be used.... no one is going to sort through everyone's feedback descriptions trying to find the person that does the sort of feedback they want, but what if there was just a list, "People willing to give grammatical help", "People who feel comfortable with 'the feeling I get from it' help", "People who are comfortable with help regarding consistency" and so forth. The headings could be added as people named things they wanted to be listed under. (In fact, this could be another requirement for SWG... list yourself under at least one of these. Yeah, I always bring it back to the guilds, don't I? Geez, Katz...) Listing yourself would not mean you necessarily have the time, but rather that you may be willing to be a resource when you can manage it, if people ask.

 

In fact, I think I'm going to try starting another thread for this. Man I'm energetic tonight. (For those of you that can't see, I've also made two long guild-room posts).